Smithford Street (inc. Ram Bridge)

Just reading through "A Harvest of History" about the life of J B Shelton. He says the west end of Smithford Street adjoining Fleet Street was called Ram Bridge Place. He mentions that a large water mill was discovered at a depth of 12ft 6in at the north west corner of Woolworths and that timbers of a great size, which had been mortised out were found and were probably used to hold the flood gate, which was called the "Ram" which more than likely gives its name to Ram Bridge Place.

Annewiggy, that's interesting, was there a sort of diagram?

I wish Kaga, I wish. While the loss of Shelton's pre war artefacts is heart breaking, the loss of excavation details including maps and sketches is worse. I'm slowly putting locations to dig descriptions and photos that were taken at the time. Shelton didn't have access to the number of early images I have, so in some cases I probably have a picture of a standing building he later dug up eg, there is an image of a building that spanned the river between the West Orchard bridge and the Ram Bridge, which might well be the mill, although no water wheel was in evidence by then. If I knew exactly where he was digging, I could perhaps match the two up. I'm currently trying to work out the subteranean features including descriptions, sketches and photos. It's a knotty problem that I pick up and put down, as and when I'm in the mood. A lot of the images of cellars turn out to be of the same two - one on the High Street under what is now the Halifax and the Coventry Building Society and the other is uder a council building that is on the site of the Old Star, opposite Bayley Lane. I've yet to work out how many crypts/cellars there were or if there was a true pattern to where they were located.

Sorry Kaga. It is only a booklet I have listing some of the excavations he has done. The only diagram is one of Trinity Street.

Smithford St rather than Broadgate I think. Helen F may know the white building, right centre of photo?

Prof, looks like Burtons.

It is Smithford Street and it does look like Burtons but I think it was this building on the right, a bit further east than Burtons. I don't know what it was used for.

The one in your photo, Helen, is The Picture House.

Doesn't seem to be a corner site though Kaga!

If I read everything correctly (not very usual!), Burtons building on the corner of Broadgate and the one attached next door in Smithford Street (Willsons) remained standing after the war. I think the building in question was another two down from that one, so it's possible that it was Dolcis Shoes.

Yep, what MR said above.....

I think this is the same building that Rob has in the Library Collection from a lot earlier - The gap to the right of the white building in question was I think where the Dorothy Cafe was - that went in 1934. We know this thanks to this clipping that I think Anne shared some time ago - where Willsons is in Robs image : Also here - is that the same building though to the left? It looks significantly different (and shorter!) than in Prof's photo in Post #326, as if it had only just had a 'modern' deco facelift -

Midland Red. I think you're right, but then you know camera angle shots better than I. Prof's photo was a wartime shot that altered daily, the building in question was nowhere near the size of Burtons in height, the building on the right was Easterns, set back a couple of yards, in between Dolcis and Willsons. Easterns was removed leaving Prof's photo, a few weeks later Dolcis was removed and the top part of Willsons was left derelict, only the ground floor was renovated as a shop. The house this side of the road was part of the Kings Head.

To get back to the Prof's photo. It doesn't look like it was Burtons or Willsons because there are destroyed buildings to the right. I still think that it might be the remains of the picture theatre. It's the only white painted building west of Willsons. View from Britain from above

Helen F. Sorry but what date are you looking at? On the night of the blitz, two buildings were glossy white, the one next to Willsons and the one next door below it - both got damaged, and everything below them down to Fleet Street was wiped out. Prof's photo was taken from above ground level and that is a puzzle for everything had been destroyed opposite Willsons.